The True Football

You are right in saying that nowadays Spaniards co...

2010-07-28T01:07:51.701-05:00

You are right in saying that nowadays Spaniards couldn’t hang a Spanish flag around Barcelona naturally knowing that, if you did so, you’d put yourself in risk of being told off. On one hand I think nobody should be frightened of waving a Spanish flag but in the other, I support those who hang a Basque (Ikurriña) or Catalan (Señera) flag. We have to learn that flags are not related with ideology or to a certain behavior and we should stop making preconceived judgments and delete “fascist and independent” words from our vocabulary.
At the same time we have to broaden our understanding to those regions that are fighting for their own management autonomy within the limits established by the National Government.
Also we have to respect the wide range of ideologies and don’t criticize or wrongly classify people by what they think.
I don’t consider myself independentist but I must say I feel happier when my local team (my city’s population is 250.000 aprox.) went up to first division rather than Spain wining the World cup.

...

Tienes razón que los españoles, hoy día no podían llevar una bandera de España a la espalda tranquilamente por Barcelona, o saber que no te van a decir nada por portar la bandera española. Pero creo que todavía a esos españoles que llevaron su bandera con orgullo y sin taparse de nadie, entendiendo que por portar esa bandera no tenia porque estar asociado a alguna ideología o comportamiento determinado, deberían no asustarse cuando alguien porta una Ekurriña o una Señeira entre otras banderas. Debemos respetar a esas comunidades, creo en que el ejercicio de la autogestión a todos los niveles de una Comunidad autónoma es posible para la misma, y que no por luchar por tu comunidad o por portar una bandera de tu comunidad eres un nacionalista / separatista, al igual que nadie debería tachar de "fascista" o cualquier otro improperio por llevar una bandera española.
Además deberíamos respetar las ideas de la gente sin calificarlas erróneamente, yo no me considero independentista, pero me alegro muchísimo más que mi equipo de una ciudad de 250 habitantes subiera a primera división antes que España ganara el mundial.

As someone who has, at times, no doubt been though...

2010-07-27T22:45:27.991-05:00

As someone who has, at times, no doubt been thought of as one of those "right wing nut-jobs" (Hint:I'm not), I found this article to be rather insulting and demeaning. I mean, be honest...NASCAR is supposedly a red blooded, conservative, southern sport, yet what really goes on at a race? 60 white, southern men go to the left for 3 hours. Look at the revenue sharing aspects of the MLB or the NFL, shitty teams like the Expo...I mean Nationals, hapless losers like the Cubs and any team that doesnt' end with Red Sox or Yankees get's a portion of the league's revenue simply for existing. Sounds like a redistribution of wealth to me, and what about the salary caps and wage restrictions in the NFL and the NBA, if politics really were the reason that conservatives didn't like soccer, because it was "socialist" then methinks they would do well to remove the "socialisim" in ther own house first.

It is my belief that a growing American interest in soccer would only help the sport world wide, as much as the establishment would hate it, but we Americans demand nothing less than perfection from our ref's and umps, and you'd better belive that when we host the WC again...there will be some sort of replay system, goal line cameras, or extra ref in place. Heaven forbid that the horrible calls that threatened to drag down this most recen Copa Mundial happen in say...Philly, there would be more batteries on the pitch than at a Nickleback concert.

Also, America was built on the inclusion of other cultures and other persons, it's who we are, it's why...unless you are a Commanche or some sort of Indian, there is no "American" ALL of us have foreign roots, it's that very melting pot that would allow soccer to blossom should the US really embrace it. I mean, I own German and Holland team shirts, yet firecely supported the USMNT, but I had no problems with realzing that my heritage is French, German and a tiny bit of Dutch and therefore could cheer those teams on almost as much as I cheered on the US....well, except for France, somethings aren't done in polite company.

Ok, I really am rambling now, this comment has wandered further, and with less direction than Lionel Messi agasinst Germany, so I will simply end it by saying to the author of the article in 442..."Go fornicate yourself with an iron stick" peace.

greatest commercial ever.

2010-07-27T19:50:25.038-05:00

greatest commercial ever.

Well said Mike. G. Gordon Liddy? Is that the guy w...

2010-07-27T14:59:05.753-05:00

Well said Mike. G. Gordon Liddy? Is that the guy who was arrested because of Watergate or this dude trying to sell me gold?

Hi everyone!! As everybody Know "Spain is differe...

2010-07-27T13:26:05.110-05:00

Hi everyone!!

As everybody Know "Spain is different". This great statement that everybody know about Spain has been fulfilled during last weeks.

I hope don't wake up of this dream but sadly we only have to read newspaper everyday to realize how young democratic country we are.

In ancient Rome used to say "bread and circus" for the people...

It's sad to see that some sportmen do not want to...

2010-07-27T06:53:04.766-05:00

It's sad to see that some sportmen do not want to raise the spanish flag. I hope we start differing between sport and politics, and, much more, between patriotism and political ideology.

PS. i forgot to mention my thought on the team ame...

2010-07-27T02:30:24.857-05:00

PS. i forgot to mention my thought on the team america link: hilarious.

no need to say "yikes." maybe i read too much into...

2010-07-27T02:27:29.118-05:00

no need to say "yikes." maybe i read too much into the article but i was just annoyed by yet another excuse about why we don't like football when now more than ever, the numbers are showing that it's growing stronger in our culture. my problem with this article is that i feel at times it reduces us to a bunch of imbeciles who apparently all fall in line with the beliefs of a few right-wing nutjobs. to claim that liddy's theory on soccer "goes to the heart of why the self-proclaimed land of the free has never fully embraced the sport of the free-kick" just seems like too static of a generalization, especially when he sums up the article with something far more substantial about the "unpredictable, amorphous and organic" nature of football. because mom taught me if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all, i'll finish with this: mr simpson's article could start a healthy dialogue on the state of soccer in the US and that's well worth it.

Yikes, I think what my excited friend is trying sa...

2010-07-26T19:38:27.487-05:00

Yikes, I think what my excited friend is trying say is:

America, Fuck Yeah!

On a serious note, what Mike D. and I were discussing is the strange dichotomy between the foreign flak Americans get for not respecting soccer to the full extent that it could, and the reasonable assumption that the same sources of snobbery would be outraged if America, taking footy seriously, somehow won the World Cup.

So maybe it would be best if these voices that correlate American neglect of soccer to some sort of ingrained xenophobia would do well consider that they might not be so pleased if the best American athletes didn't play other sports.

this is a fantastic article. so soccer isn't the b...

2010-07-26T18:54:14.249-05:00

this is a fantastic article. so soccer isn't the biggest sport in the US. so we like "barbaric" football, "boring" baseball, or "flashy" basketball more. so what? japan, korea, taiwan and most caribbean countries claim baseball as their number 1 sport. canada and the scandinavian countries claim hockey first. india, pakistan and most of oceania lives and dies with cricket. i have never heard dialogue concerning why these countries will never fully accept soccer. it's pretty annoying to read articles like mr. simpson's when here in the states, it's pretty obvious that his explanation is short-sighted and ignorant. i know the lengths some of my friends were going through to catch a few world cup games, even if their status as football fans would be labeled "casual." mr. simpson can't tell me we won't watch soccer because we all have some right-wing aversion to the game. in this article, he is a man still bearing a torch that has burned out many years ago. it's highly unlikely that soccer will ever surpass american football or baseball in popularity. but it could attain a solid third place in our sporting hearts considering the MLS' savvy management, a possible NBA lockout and the dwindling appeal of NHL hockey. but honestly, as mark and i were discussing recently, does anyone really want the US to embrace soccer with full force? what will the old guard think when the US is consistently ranked top 5 in the football world? if history is any indication, the US is known for giving 110% to any cause its people feel the need to undertake (for a quick primer, see: "american revolution," "american civil war," "manifest destiny," "industrialization," "man on the moon"). i'm just saying look out because we're pretty good at the things we feel are important. we also don't like to have our entire culture marginalized by archaic, unenlightened thinking. with all due respect mr. simpson, don't tread on us.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gadsden_flag

From Spain: Living in a world marching towards the...

2010-07-26T17:20:13.202-05:00

From Spain:
Living in a world marching towards the global unit, is strange to see how people is more concerned with local/regional issues rather than trying to get that unit. Here and now, every single goal reached by a national what-ever (sport team, individual person,...) wakes up our patriotism.
So sad.
But true.

growing up in the US with a spanish grandfather, i...

2010-07-26T15:11:43.029-05:00

growing up in the US with a spanish grandfather, i was well aware of my heritage. my great-grandmother (a.k.a. "abuelita") left spain in the '30s to come to the US by way of cuba. my family made sure i knew the story well. but they also made sure of something else-- i knew that i wasn't just spanish. more specifically i was "asturiano." i knew early on that this was important to know about myself. so here we are, officially an american family with essentially no ties to spain except abuelita who was now an american citizen, and deep down in our hearts (as if it mattered to anyone in the states) we knew we were (at least partly) asturianos. my family based their lives around ybor city, the great latin enclave of tampa, florida. interestingly, ybor city had many "centros," which were essentially community centers for the city's people most often divided on country lines. there was a centro español, a centro italiano, and, of course, a centro asturiano. that's how deep the ties went. the point is that even way over here across the pond, i knew that spain isn't one united, homogenous place. to me, watching spain win the world cup was the next best thing to watching the US win so I was happy but well aware that the idea of "spain" is more like "madrid and all the places that fall under its governmental jurisdiction but may or may not care about the fact that, technically, they are spanish." even dissect the team from the finals and you'll see it's literally a microcosm of spain itself. we all know the calatans and basques but there's also folks from madrid (iker, torres), the canary islands (pedro), andalusia (sergio ramos, jesus navas), and asturias (of course, david "el guaje" villa). i know the jubilation will be short-lived and I don't know if there will ever be an answer to uniting a state that is so divided but sport is a nice way to start.

Wow. Thank you for participating, all of you! It...

2010-07-26T12:03:38.322-05:00

Wow. Thank you for participating, all of you!

It is not as recent of course, but we have had a nasty civil war as well (the bloodiest war in our country's history). Still to this day, there are clamors for national secession from certain areas of the South and Texas. There is no doubt that these places have their own valid culture and traditions (although comparing them with the rich cultures of Pais Vasco and Catalonia may be a bit short-coming for us). However, for more people than less, we are Americans first. Segmentation is part of what makes us different, but most of us agree that we are differently the same.

The very idea of the United States is in this regard. We are literally states (countries) that are united. Each of the 50 has it's own central govt that operates similarly to the federal govt.

I don't think one can underestimate how great of a factor language is in determining national identity. Certainly, the U.S. federal government never had to suppress English, as the Fascist Govt did to Catalan, Basque and others. It is easy to see how one can feel threatened and angry to the point of revolt about such an extreme and unfair censorship.

As Spaniards, what do you think it would take to achieve an accord with the separatist movements so that they, at the very least, would accept the idea of being part of Spain? Or is this even possible and independence is the only positive outcome? Is there any initiative that the Spanish Govt could do to help amend the issues (such as facilitating the education system to teach kids about all the regions as suggested by Javi's comment, or even making national holidays for each region, for instance a Catalan Day, Basque Day, Galician Day...where the traditions and languages of each region could be celebrated across the country)? Would this be patronizing and insulting more than it would be respectful and celebratory?

If this article and it's subsequent comments has shown anything, it has shown that there exists at least one segment of Spanish people who have a hope for a different sort of future. And that these hope are not necessarily the reflection of the current status quo. Let us continue to make our balanced voices heard, where we can and as long as we can, so that the achievement of self-actualized national identity can be realized by all in a peaceful, respectful and safe way.

Thanks everyone here!. Mark , let me try to trans...

2010-07-26T10:44:12.088-05:00

Thanks everyone here!.

Mark , let me try to translate this last comment as it is quite interesting.

"I reckon this is a temporary feeling, because Spain is far from being utterly united. There was a time (he's referring to the Spanish civil war) when many Spaniards were obliged to use the flag (it had a different coat of arms in the middle by then) and told to be ONLY SPANISH to avoid the dissolution of the Peninsula into different regions. It is completely understandable that some of those people who could not use their coofficial languages (Catalan, Gallego or Vasco for instance) now are reluctant to be known as Spaniards.
A number of them are reacting with a lack of respect to the rest of the citizens, sometimes even acting violently.
When we are able to judge and apologize ourselves for all those mistakes made in the past, Spain will be a united nation even if we lose football games”.

Muy buen artículo felicidades Ana. Creo que este...

2010-07-26T10:16:56.264-05:00

Muy buen artículo felicidades Ana.
Creo que este sentimiento es temporal, porque España no está del todo unida. Hubo una época en España, en la que se usaba esta bandera, que a muchos les obligaron a ser españoles, y es normal que rechacen un símbolo que les prohibió incluso usar la lengua que sus padres les enseñaron. Algunos han respondido a esta agresión faltando al respeto al resto de españoles, a veces incluso con violencia. Cuando seamos capaces juzgarnos y perdonarnos, a nosotros mismos, los errores del pasado, España será un país unido los días que no ganemos en el fútbol.

Too true. As a United States citizen living in S...

2010-07-26T08:11:57.341-05:00

Too true.

As a United States citizen living in Spain I have to say Spaniards are not as nationalistic as in the States, there is a lack of brotherhhood here, so to speak. In the States when there is a need to help other people rise quickly to the occasion. Here in Spain people rise to help others in other countries but dont come together to raise the country. To me this is very strange. Spaniards will help clean up the Prestige oil spill but dont come together to fight to make others lives better. Rather they have fun pointing out their differences between other Spaniards, Catalans, Bascos, etc...

I did feel a unity during the World cup that I never felt before here. It was nice while it lasted but I agree it is probably temporary.

Alexis K.

Hi there, In my opinion it is a great article, co...

2010-07-26T06:58:35.929-05:00

Hi there,
In my opinion it is a great article, congratulations Ana. I am Spanish and recently living abroad so I am really proud about my country. In the last years and days we have seen how Spanish people are a brilliant sucess at their sport disciplines (Basketball Team, handball team, Nadal, Pedrosa and Lorenzo,tennis team, Spanish football team and lastly Contador and Fernando Alonso yesterday). I believe a lot of Spaniards are proud about being Spanish because we have grown in this maravellous country and nobody taught us that we are different to other Spanish regions. It happens in some parts of our peninsula and we should respect their views despite we disagree. The American feeling it is so strong because the are learning about their own history at school, spending a lot of time in that. Sadly our so far history has been really bloody and dark. The success in sport field could be the image of a new era for our still "new young country" despite the recession...

Javi River

Verdaderamente un fantástico comentario Ana, Españ...

2010-07-26T04:49:52.805-05:00

Verdaderamente un fantástico comentario Ana, España por bandera siempre. Mis más sinceras felicitaciones.

As a Spaniard, I could not agree more. I just hope...

2010-07-26T01:56:41.371-05:00

As a Spaniard, I could not agree more. I just hope we won't forget this instant of unity and "sane" patriotism...

It was 1990 when Italy hosted the World Cup. We h...

2010-07-26T00:25:42.097-05:00

It was 1990 when Italy hosted the World Cup. We had inserted ourselves into the local football tribe of kids that met at the beaches that we patronized. We were getting tired of playing on a stony beach, and one of the Italian boys told us about a local monastery that had a courtyard of fenced in cement where they allowed kids to play. So our tribe of shirtless, scabby, dirt ridden pre-adolescent boys set off to find this holy garden of footballer's Eden.
Upon arriving there, we quickly discovered that one had to make his way through the monasteries interior, through the monk’s garden and into the cement football court. I of course was a bit disturbed at this, not knowing the proper etiquette that was required in a monastery. I envisioned peeved monks chasing us away and waving their yardsticks at us if we made a mistake. Needless to say I was very methodical upon entering for the first time.
I learned a lot though during these outings: I learned not to hit the house behind one of the goals, unless you wanted an old woman to come of her house and scream at you in unintelligible Italian waving a broomstick. I learned that the monks were not setting a devious trap to lure us into a strict discussion of proper behavior and ethics. I learned another very important lesson. During one of our games I kicked the ball over the 6 foot chain link fence that surrounded the courtyard. It bounced through the vegetable garden and hit a monk on his backside as he tended his crop. At this point I froze as if Medusa had stared straight into my soul and turned me to marble; ready to sprint away or climb the outer stone wall like Spider-man, attempting to flee the flailing yardstick and barrage of Italian indoctrination I envisioned soon to be approaching. Instead to my surprise this monk trapped the ball with his knee and volleyed it back to us out of the air with his huge leather sandal. This was the moment that my stereotype of what religion was supposed to be was challenged. That court was invaluable to me; without it I probably would still only know Catholic doctrine to be comprised of stuffy priests and strict rules set to the backdrop of overly gilded ceremonies of self sacrifice.
Father Paul was a pioneer, one that deserves to be congratulated rather than punished. His attempt to merge his congregation’s timely excitement and love of football with the spiritual guidance and doctrine of his mass probably challenged a set code; but to me he was reaching out to a younger generation and pulling them into the church by means of a common interest. As shown in this quote:
“”Obdam Parish vice chairman Win Bijman who said his congregation was "shocked and disappointed" by the popular priest's suspension."People do not understand it. Everybody supports Pastor Paul and we don't see what was so bad that he should be temporarily suspended. Maybe we allowed ourselves to be swept along a little too much in the Oranje euphoria," he added, referring to the Dutch football team. "But it is part of Pastor Paul's personality that he manages to harness that kind of enthusiasm to get people into church. The church here is full and in other places churches are empty."”1
If one youngster is drawn back into Father Paul’s mass in the future because he uses current events and timely interests, I believe that he has done an excellent job.
I am wise cracker by nature and in my summation I’ll finish with this; while I have no desire to see our local parish look like the inside of a “Hooters”; had the clergyman included our favorite interests in his mass, and ended with everyone walking outside to beer and wholesome grub; I would have gone 3 times a week. You got to know what motivates people!

1 http://msn.foxsports.com/foxsoccer/worldcup/story/Catholic-priest-Netherlands-World-Cup-orange-mass-suspended-071610

While church may be universal, so is sport! As a ...

2010-07-26T00:25:18.981-05:00

While church may be universal, so is sport! As a young boy I learned to love football very much. It would be playing football that would eventually help my brother and I break the language and cultural barrier that was presented to us on visits to Italy to see our grandparents. Football would even teach me to look past my preconceptions about church.
As a young child church always seemed a bit too staunch and formal for my tastes. I had the idea that church meant boring, and having to listen to very long sermons that did not connect to me personally, in an uncomfortable atmosphere. However, I remember very clearly when I realized that church was not synonymous with “painful”.

Really great article- and I have to say many of th...

2010-07-25T21:57:39.374-05:00

Really great article- and I have to say many of the issues that you discussed ring true even for fans outside of Spain.

As a fan of France- I have seen both the power a trophy like the World Cup has to bring a nation together...and how fleeting that unity is. In 1998, the team was hailed for its diversity- now that diveristy is being singled out for France's failures.

Though I will admit that I was not rooting for Spain this World Cup (sorry!)- it was great to see that the players on the team were able to put aside political differences and come together. Though- like you- Im skeptical that this will last longer than the euphoria. Come club season, Im certain those divisions will be back to being playing out on the field...

While socioeconomic divisions still play a powerful role in the dynamics of the French team, I am optimistic that we can move forward as well (it helps to not have a complete idiot as the coach).

5'9' is average height breh, don't go giving yours...

2010-07-23T11:28:28.188-05:00

5'9' is average height breh, don't go giving yourself two and half inches...

...in height

i would like to expand the association. here's a l...

2010-07-22T17:39:45.242-05:00

i would like to expand the association. here's a list of players that played in either the final or 3rd place game that could be considered "wee-men":

wesley sniejder-5'7"
andrés iniesta-5'7"
xavi-5'7"
jesus navas-5'7"
pedro-5'6.5" (that's 5'7" at the DMV)
philip lahm-5'7"
marko marin-5'7"
walter gargano-5'6"
egidio arévalo-5'6"
sebastian fernandez-5'5.5" (5'6" at the DMV)

this of course, doesn't include the under 5'9"ers who include (among others): de jong, van der vaart, fabregas, david villa, and maxi pereira.

a little light in the defense department but all in all, not a bad group of folks to be associated with.

Tricky syllables not so simple for dumb ass "canno...

2010-07-20T23:22:58.627-05:00

Tricky syllables
not so simple for dumb ass
"cannot skip proof-read"